With In-Person Concerts Back, What Will Happen to Livestream Audiences?

Sam Blake

Sam primarily covers entertainment and media for dot.LA. Previously he was Marjorie Deane Fellow at The Economist, where he wrote for the business and finance sections of the print edition. He has also worked at the XPRIZE Foundation, U.S. Government Accountability Office, KCRW, and MLB Advanced Media (now Disney Streaming Services). He holds an MBA from UCLA Anderson, an MPP from UCLA Luskin and a BA in History from University of Michigan. Email him at samblake@dot.LA and find him on Twitter @hisamblake

With In-Person Concerts Back, What Will Happen to Livestream Audiences?

In-person concerts are coming back.

In California, venues have received the provisional go-ahead to open at full capacity by June 15 so long as statewide COVID numbers continue their downward trend.

But 15 months after venues shuttered, the music world has changed. Tech companies, musicians and even in-person concert promoters have built an entirely new ecosystem around livestreaming shows, evolving them into a slicker and more well-produced medium than existed before the pandemic.

Events companies and labels have invested big in new livestreaming technology. Even musicians have come to love some of the flexibility and direct contact that these new, sometimes more lucrative, formats allow.

Livestreamed shows will likely remain a permanent fixture in the music industry. Yet the extent to which this new medium expands and adapts depends on the most important stakeholder of all: fans.

So far, it seems clear that fans are ready for in-person shows to return. Live Nation, the world's biggest concert promoter, reported that sales for 2022 tours are up double-digits compared to the same period pre-pandemic. Over 80% of fans have opted to hold onto tickets for shows that were postponed during the pandemic, rather than request a refund, the company said.

But there are also signs that fans like livestreaming. Amazon-owned Twitch has seen music streaming grow 550% on its platform, year-over-year, according to the company. Arjun Mehta, CEO of L.A.-based livestreaming platform Moment House, said over 150,000 users have voluntarily given their phone numbers to receive twice-monthly notifications about upcoming shows. And LiveXLive, a publicly traded Beverly Hills-based digital music company, says it's seen livestreaming views grow 533% year-over-year. The company forecasts its 2021 revenues will be between $100 million and $110 million, up from a 2020 high point of $38.7 million.

Yet the appeal to audiences of livestreaming has not been tested at a time when fans' options aren't limited by a global pandemic.

"I still feel like it's too early to be able to come up with real insights," Mehta conceded. "There just hasn't been enough time or volume yet."

And even in the absence of live shows, livestreams can struggle to attract fans.

"A lot of these events have been like trees falling in the forest," said Tim Westergren, the founder of Pandora who now runs livestreaming platform Sessions, at a recent panel hosted by Music Ally, a trade publication.

Add-On Experience Or a New Frontier?

Companies that operate in other parts of the music industry have begun dipping their toes into livestreaming. In January, Live Nation acquired a majority stake in Veeps, an L.A-based livestreaming platform that hosted over 1,000 shows in 2020. Together, the companies plan to outfit 60 venues across the country with equipment that will enable them to livestream in-person concerts. Live Nation chief executive Michael Rapino has even floated the idea of launching a "Festival TV" streaming channel.

Spotify is in on the action as well, having partnered with four livestreaming platforms, including Hollywood-based StageIt, to share artists' livestream schedules with fans. The Swedish company has also announced it will begin streaming concert video on its platform, though the first batch will be pre-recorded rather than live shows.

And for the first time ever, live-events analytics firm Pollstar has begun tracking livestreamed show data, albeit a bit crudely – with little distinction between free and ticketed events.

Regardless of the exact numbers, most observers agree that beaming a live show across the internet can draw a bigger crowd.

"It's a way for venues to drive incremental revenue, which at scale adds up," Mehta said. "But it's not necessarily as great of an experience as it can be for the fans [at home]."

That is why he and others are most intrigued by what livestreaming can do as a medium that embraces its primary purpose as a digital experience.

Travis Scott's concert in the popular video game Fortnite last April was an early example of this. The event featured Scott performing as a gigantic digitized version of himself in a virtual universe where the laws of physics don't apply. Wave followed later in the summer with shows from John Legend and The Weeknd, with the added twist that the avatar representing the artists was being controlled in real-time by the real artist. Creativity has continued and insiders say there is plenty of room for more.

"We're talking about a segment of entertainment that's driven by artists," Veeps Vice President Greg Patterson said.

Image courtesy of Veeps

'A Beautiful Thing': More Control (and Cash) for Artists

For that creativity to be unlocked, the artists must participate, and so far it appears the economics of livestreaming are increasingly attracting those who were once skeptical.

"Everyone I know who did it and did it well was like, 'I made more than I've ever made in a single night," said L.A.-based music manager Ryan Vaughn. "Everybody was so resistant [before], almost entitled, where you have to be in the room, have to experience [the performance]. Now it's like, 'Fuck it, I don't even have to leave the house'."

Veeps said its shows put over $10 million into artists' pockets in 2020.

Twitch said the number of musicians expected to earn more than $25,000 per year on its platform grew 1635% from January 2020 to February 2021. And these artists are monetizing a fairly small fanbase: as of late October, the median followership for musicians making over $50,000 on the platform was just 183. Industry analyst Will Page has shown that, on average, artists can monetize fans on Twitch about 10-times better than on audio streaming platforms such as Spotify and Apple Music.

That means artists can theoretically double their revenue by migrating 10% of their audio-streaming audience on Spotify or Pandora to a livestreaming video audience on Twitch.

These data are encouraging for livestreaming, but extrapolating those figures into a post-pandemic era may not hold up.

Singer-songwriter Rufus Wainwright sees livestream concerts as a new creative avenue for artists. He's been one of Veeps' most active performers, doing over 40 shows on the platform since 2020.

"From what I can tell it was meaningful to my fans, but honestly was incredibly helpful to me as well," he said in a written statement. "I was also thrilled that it was a way to keep some of the musicians and engineers I have been working with on payroll. I am ready to go out into the world and do live shows again but I think the streaming world is here to stay and that is a beautiful thing."

Moment House's CEO said he's heard similar things from artists who've performed on his platform. Livestreaming is no longer a stand-in for an in-person experience, but a new format with its own artistic potential.

"I think artists are really starting to see that it's a creative format, and not just a tech activity," said Mehta. He pointed to an Instagram post from Charlotte Cardin, who after selling 15,000 tickets to her livestreamed concert on Moment House in late April wrote: "Working on this livestream has been one of the most artistically stimulating experiences I've ever had."

Earlier this year, Warner Music Group signed partnerships with L.A.-based startups Wave and Genies, a sign that the record label wants to bring its vaunted roster of artists into the metaverse and give them more tools to explore livestreaming as a creative outlet.

But all of those ambitions depend on fans continuing to embrace the new medium, even as their options open back up. So as they return to watch more in-person concerts, the music industry will likely be watching right back.


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Genies Wants To Help Creators Build ‘Avatar Ecosystems’

Christian Hetrick

Christian Hetrick is dot.LA's Entertainment Tech Reporter. He was formerly a business reporter for the Philadelphia Inquirer and reported on New Jersey politics for the Observer and the Press of Atlantic City.

Genies Wants To Help Creators Build ‘Avatar Ecosystems’

When avatar startup Genies raised $150 million in April, the company released an unusual message to the public: “Farewell.”

The Marina del Rey-based unicorn, which makes cartoon-like avatars for celebrities and aims to “build an avatar for every single person on Earth,” didn’t go under. Rather, Genies announced it would stay quiet for a while to focus on building avatar-creation products.

Genies representatives told dot.LA that the firm is now seeking more creators to try its creation tools for 3D avatars, digital fashion items and virtual experiences. On Thursday, the startup launched a three-week program called DIY Collective, which will mentor and financially support up-and-coming creatives.

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Here's What To Expect At LA Tech Week

Christian Hetrick

Christian Hetrick is dot.LA's Entertainment Tech Reporter. He was formerly a business reporter for the Philadelphia Inquirer and reported on New Jersey politics for the Observer and the Press of Atlantic City.

Here's What To Expect At LA Tech Week

LA Tech Week—a weeklong showcase of the region’s growing startup ecosystem—is coming this August.

The seven-day series of events, from Aug. 15 through Aug. 21, is a chance for the Los Angeles startup community to network, share insights and pitch themselves to investors. It comes a year after hundreds of people gathered for a similar event that allowed the L.A. tech community—often in the shadow of Silicon Valley—to flex its muscles.

From fireside chats with prominent founders to a panel on aerospace, here are some highlights from the roughly 30 events happening during LA Tech Week, including one hosted by dot.LA.

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PCH Driven: Director Jason Wise Talks Wine, Documentaries, and His New Indie Streaming Service SOMMTV

Jamie Williams
­Jamie Williams is the host of the “PCH Driven” podcast, a show about Southern California entrepreneurs, innovators and its driven leaders on their road to success. The series celebrates and reveals the wonders of the human spirit and explores the motivations behind what drives us.
Jason Wise holding wine glass
Image courtesy of Jason Wise

Jason Wise may still consider himself a little kid, but the 33-year-old filmmaker is building an IMDB page that rivals colleagues twice his age.

As the director behind SOMM, SOMM2, SOMM3, and the upcoming SOMM4, Wise has made a career producing award-winning documentary films that peer deep into the wine industry in Southern California and around the world.

On this episode of the PCH Driven podcast, he talks about life growing up in Cleveland as a horrible student, filmmaking, Los Angeles and his latest entrepreneurial endeavor: A streaming service called SOMMTV that features–what else?–documentaries about wine.

The conversation covers some serious ground, but the themes of wine and film work to anchor the discussion, and Wise dispenses bits of sage filmmaking advice.

“With a documentary you can just start filming right now,” he says. “That’s how SOMM came about. I got tossed into that world during the frustration of trying to make a different film, and I just started filming it, because no one could stop me because I was paying for it myself. That’s the thing with docs,” or “The good thing about SOMM is that you can explain it in one sentence: ‘The hardest test in the world is about wine, and you’ve never heard about it.’”

…Or at least maybe you hadn’t before he made his first film. Now with three SOMM documentaries under his belt, Wise is nearing completion of “SOMM4: Cup of Salvation,” which examines the history of wine’s relationship with religion. Wise says it’s “a wild film,” that spans multiple countries, the Vatican and even an active warzone. As he puts it, the idea is to show that “wine is about every subject,” rather than “every subject is about wine.”

For Wise, the transition to launching his own streaming service came out of his frustration with existing platforms holding too much power over the value of the content he produces.

“Do we want Netflix to tell us what our projects are worth or do we want the audience to do that?” he asks.

But unlike giants in the space, SOMMTV has adopted a gradual approach of just adding small bits of content as they develop. Without the need to license 500 or 1,000 hours of programming, Wise has been able to basically bootstrap SOMMTV and provide short form content and other more experimental offerings that typically get passed over by the Hulus and Disneys of the world.

So far, he says, the experiment is working, and now Wise is looking to raise some serious capital to keep up with the voracious appetites of his subscribers.

“Send those VCs my way,” Wise jokes.

Subscribe to PCH Driven on Apple, Stitcher, Spotify, iHeart, Google or wherever you get your podcasts.

dot.LA reporter David Shultz contributed to this report.